Men of the Fighting Lady

Started by Rick Wilkes · 40 · 4 years ago · F9F, IModeler at the Movies
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    david leigh-smith said 6 years, 1 month ago:

    We'll make a psychologist of you, yet, Tom. Good spot - they're crazy.

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    david leigh-smith said 6 years, 1 month ago:

    Noooooooooooooooo, Rick. Your desk was so neat, everything lined up, nice right angles and parallel settings. Now look. Well, no, I can't look at that.

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    Rick Wilkes said 6 years, 1 month ago:

    And to think that mess comes from a brain that used to easily cope with some of the busiest, most complicated air traffic in the US. Maybe that’s it, after 34 years my mind may have turned into tapioca pudding. Couldn’t at least have turned into something I like, chocolate pudding would have been great. 😉

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    Jaime Carreon said 6 years, 1 month ago:

    Rick and Louis - I may have steered you wrong on the exhaust - the "mixtures" were not adjustable by the pilot, that was done to the fuel control unit on the engine by maintenance. It's sort of like setting the mixtures on a carburetor. The exhaust color could range from sooty black to tan to gray depending on the quality of the fuel and how well or poorly the JFC was set.

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    Rick Wilkes said 6 years, 1 month ago:

    Jamie, I thought the tan/white-ish exhaust pipes were because they may have been using avgas for fuel. I know the USAF did that in the early jet days.
    Thoughts?

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    Jaime Carreon said 6 years, 1 month ago:

    The Panther is powered by a Pratt and Whitney J-42 engine, which is a license built version of the Rolls Royce Nene engine. It was designed from the outset to run on kerosene, which has a higher flash point and is more stable than gasoline, which is a good thing considering the high temperatures at which jet engines operate. The engine will run on avgas (unlike their piston counterparts, jets will run on damn near anything that will burn), but performance will suffer quite a bit and there would be some major tweaking needed to the fuel control unit, as the densities of the two fuels are quite different. Modern engine fuel controls are all computer controlled these days.

    I've actually worked on that engine, as it also powers the Canadair built T-33. A historical aside - Rolls Royce "donated" a number of these Nene engines to the Russians in the late 40's as a goodwill gesture. The Soviets then reverse engineered them and stuck them in the MiG-15. Needless to say, many US pilots were not terribly impressed with that Rolls Royce idea...

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    Louis Gardner said 6 years, 1 month ago:

    Thanks for clarifying the way the fuel mixture was adjusted. I misunderstood you and didn't mean to confuse anyone with a false statement. I also appreciate the heads up about the different things to look for in the movie.

    Yeah I don't think the decision to "Share" the RR Nene was a good one at the time either. Sooner or later they would have been able to "locate" one I'm sure. I remember hearing a story that the decision to do so was based on the outcome of a game of billiards...

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    Tom Cleaver said 6 years, 1 month ago:

    That's the F9F-2. the F9F-5 used the American version of the Tay, the J-48. It was an "advanced Nene."

    I was lucky last year to interview then-99 year old Colonel Ross Mickey, who was the guy most responsible for the J-42 being produced in America. (Two months later, a week after his 100th birthday, he "departed the pattern" - first WW2 commander of VMF(N)-542, and commander of the F3D Skynights that came to Korea in 1952 - one of the pioneers who created 24/7 naval aviation)

    As he put it, when he was tasked with being the Marine on the F9F-1 (the 4-engine night fighter), "My contribution to the Panther was asking why we were worried about creating a good jet-powered night fighter when we didn't have a good jet-powered day fighter." The F9F-2 was the result.

    He also convinced the Navy to approve a license-built Nene, despite its violation of the NIH Rule (Not Invented Here). "the Nene we got was one of those wonderful Rolls-Royce hand-built products that looked like a jewel and could never be recreated. Thank god we were able to productionize it the way Packard productionized the Merlin."

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    Tom Cleaver said 6 years, 1 month ago:

    No, Britain did not "donate" the Nene to the Russians. I don't know where you got that, but there are a lot of schmucks out there promoting "alternative facts" about many things, and they are the likely source. I write about this in my coming book "Holding The Line: Naval Aviation in the Korean War."

    The Labour government approved a Russian trade delegation in 1946 to review many items. No one in England recognized Artem Mikoyan or V.I. Klimov - (Mikoyan of MiG and Klimov of engines) - as being the main members of the delegation. who were amazed to see the Nene. Sir Stafford Crips, then Minister of Commerce, was happy to negotiate the sale of 16 Nenes and a license to produce them in the Soviet Union - on the condition that they be used for"commercial projects only." Ernest Bevan, who knew first-hand from the trade union struggle how much one could trust a communist promise, and was Foreign Minister, argued strongly against the agreement but was overruled by Prime Minister Clement Attlee (of whom Churchill had once said "A modest little man, with much to be modest about.") Admittedly, 1946 was a time when one could still cite the USSR as a prime ally in World War 2 and before the Iron Curtain had rung down "From Stettin in the Baltic to Trieste in the Adriatic..." Churchill did in the speech from which that quote comes.

    When told that the sale had gone through, Stalin said "Why are they so stupid as to sell this to us?"

    In the end, Rolls-Royce never got a dime in royalties, since the Russians claimed that their Nene, the VK-1, was so different in the redesign to productionize the engine (See my other post for Colonel Ross Mickey's comment about the original Rolls-Royce engine) that it was a "different engine altogether" (this was actually settled in Russia's favor in the international court).

    The VK-1 was very close to the J-42 (both being efforts to "productionize" the R-R original). It's very interesting that one powered the airplane that changed the Korean air war (the MiG-15) and the other powered the only 1st-generation jet that could "hang in there" against the MiG-15.

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    Rick Wilkes said 6 years, 1 month ago:

    Been awhile since I made a post concerning the Panther so here’s an update to show that I’ve actually accomplished something lol.

    As usual I’m bogged down on detail painting and work that I’ve made for myself.

    Got the weights into the nose and the guns installed and drilled out. The nose gear strut has been cleaned up and installed in the well which still needs washes & dry brushing.

    The cockpit is my usual mix and “match”. I found I had a Black Box Resin Cockpit set for this kit but I couldn’t get the tub to fit over the wheel well. So I started chopping bits off and fitting them to the kit cockpit tub. Then I chopped on the resin ejection seat till it fit.

    Since I was in that deep I picked up an Eduard Zoom set for the Trumpeter kit and using the kit part for a template, cut the instrument panel down so that it fit. Still got some more fiddling with this to get it so I can button up the fuselage but I’m getting there.

    Hopefully more sometime this week.

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    david leigh-smith said 6 years, 1 month ago:

    Lovely work and great post, Rick. Love that cockpit and instrument panel.

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    Robert Royes said 6 years, 1 month ago:

    Looking great, Rick.

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    Jeff Bailey said 6 years, 1 month ago:

    Agreed, Rick! I like your "custom" touches on this fine jet. This a really interesting post. Tom, thanks for all the info as well, Like many others, I had heard that the Brits had DONATED the Nene to the Soviets who were still "allies," at least on paper. It's good to know what actually happened. Stalin's comment was priceless. As soon as the fighting is over, the Money Barons take over. "Who cares who we sell this to as long as we get paid."

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    Jeff Bailey said 6 years, 1 month ago:

    Rick, it's great to see some of your work, especially on such an interesting & storied aircraft. I personally think both versions of the aircraft (straight wing and swept) are really cool and very interesting 1st generation jets.

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    Rick Wilkes said 4 years, 3 months ago:

    Well just prove I’m still alive as nature’s latest “Godzilla” stomps it’s across the planet, these are a couple of pic’s of my Panther I took tonight.

    This is the 4th attempt to get a satisfactory Gloss Sea Blue finish. The first 2 were done with Mission Models paint applied exactly as their web site directs. Lifted in sheets when I tried to remove any masking. About the only time it stuck to the model was when I was striping it off. At this point I was fed up and stuck it on the shelf of doom.

    3 was with MRP GSB which worked okay but revealed several surface flaws that needed to be fixed

    This is #4. I primed with Tamiya AS-12 then reverse masked all the coroguard areas. What you see is 5+/- coats of MRP Gloss Sea Blue built up over the last 3 days.
    Color me happy. For now anyway, tomorrow when I take the masking off, the potential exists that one of us may end up in the Johnson County Landfill.
    More later, hopefully not too much later.